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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Yes, I am a revolver nut and I just posted a thread about my .22 LR Mini revolver........but I recently came into the .25 ACP Beretta Bobcat my Dad owns and he offered to sell it to me. I used to borrow this gun quite a bit and use it for "around town" pocket carry........... And, I also just put an older polished blue and wood grip .25 Bobcat on layaway. So, soon I will be the owner of two .25 ACP Bobcats as well as a .22 LR Bobcat. He just doesn't want them anymore and he has a bunch of other pocket guns. I normally hate alloy frame guns but I can tolerate them in smaller calibers, plus these are pocket guns and the light frame saves some weight.



Here's the one I recently put money down on....

I used to mess around with the .25 when I was younger, I thought it was a pop gun back when I was 13 and I still think so. But that was before I had a CC permit and a need to deep conceal a pistol.

I agree with most of the experts that .25 ACP is a poor choice for defense, even the hottest .25's offer a blistering 150 lb. of muzzle energy. .32 ACP seems like a powerhouse in comparison.

Just wanted to ask if anyone else occasionally or full-time carries a .25 ACP for defense. I think they are neat, I have always had a soft spot for the "mouse pistols".
 

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Yes, I am a revolver nut and I just posted a thread about my .22 LR Mini revolver........but I recently came into the .25 ACP Beretta Bobcat my Dad owns and he offered to sell it to me. I used to borrow this gun quite a bit and use it for "around town" pocket carry........... And, I also just put an older polished blue and wood grip .25 Bobcat on layaway. So, soon I will be the owner of two .25 ACP Bobcats as well as a .22 LR Bobcat. He just doesn't want them anymore and he has a bunch of other pocket guns. I normally hate alloy frame guns but I can tolerate them in smaller calibers, plus these are pocket guns and the light frame saves some weight.



Here's the one I recently put money down on....

I used to mess around with the .25 when I was younger, I thought it was a pop gun back when I was 13 and I still think so. But that was before I had a CC permit and a need to deep conceal a pistol.

I agree with most of the experts that .25 ACP is a poor choice for defense, even the hottest .25's offer a blistering 150 lb. of muzzle energy. .32 ACP seems like a powerhouse in comparison.

Just wanted to ask if anyone else occasionally or full-time carries a .25 ACP for defense. I think they are neat, I have always had a soft spot for the "mouse pistols".
I'm generally a fan of small calibers for self defense ... But the .25 ACP is vastly underpowered out of those short barrel midgets. Also, get your facts straight... Get outta here with that 150 ft lbs of energy crap... The hottest .25 load won't generate over 70 ft lbs of energy! True, it's definitely better than nothing but not by a large margin!

Good shootin',

Sam
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
A lot of the people who "poo poo" the .25 ACP, don't understand the limitations.

Too many people are like ".25's are useless I carry a .45 ACP 1911" but I can't stick a 1911 of any size in my pocket to run to the store.

With size decrease comes sacrifice, you can't find a pistol the size of a baby Browning in .44 Magnum.:)
 

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A lot of the people who "poo poo" the .25 ACP, don't understand the limitations.

Too many people are like ".25's are useless I carry a .45 ACP 1911" but I can't stick a 1911 of any size in my pocket to run to the store.

With size decrease comes sacrifice, you can't find a pistol the size of a baby Browning in .44 Magnum.:)
I stand somewhat corrected and I apologize... Apparently some newer .25 ACP loads have hit the market... You can get 150 ft lbs (supposedly) but from a 22 grain slug! Not exactly self defense material... I also believe that I've read that the published velocities are not from the ultra short barrel mouse guns.

I agree with you that the limitations need to be understood and worked with.. Many would be "bad guys" will back off at the mere sight of a firearm no matter how small so in that instance muzzle energy is irrelevant anyway.
 

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A lot of people believe the .25 is not a stopping caliber gun, but I have yet to find a volunteer to test that theory. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Bobcats akimbo:)

I actually thought of carrying the other Bobcat to back the other one up:p

The 150 ft. lb. data I got was from MagSafe, the supposed .25 ACP "+P" that claims this and over 1100 fps. It may be deceptive, as in the data may be obtained from a 12" test barrel or something. I have fired the Sellier & Bellot .25 ACP and it seems to be one of the hottest factory loadings. I think FMJ would be the way to go, why waste time with HP's in that little .25 pellet when FMJ will give you the most penetration.

The Beretta Tomcat is just a little bigger but is a .32 ACP, which has lots more penetration.

I am not advocating that .25 ACP is a good defensive round, it just seems that no one carries it anymore for any actual use and it has become kind of a "niche" round. .380 and 9mm pistols keep getting smaller and smaller, and .32 ACP is making a comeback in the micropistols from KelTec and others. Besides the Beretta and the crappy Taurus PT25 I can't think of anyone else who makes a new .25 pistol.

PSA still makes licensed copies of the Baby Browning, and I would love to get one of those stainless steel Bauer .25's.
 

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I think a 25, or any gun for that matter as a deterrence may do the job for you. The crook will not know when the thing is barely big enough to be sticking out of your hand if its a small 9mm or a 25. All he knows is that he does not want to get shot. So yeah, if you're in a gun fight, you're going to have a problem, but otherwise... Next, I've also thought about these guns being used as a mechanical fist. Say you're rolling around the floor with someone trying to fight him. a 22LR or 25 to the temple at point blank range (esp more than one round), should STOP the guy right away. so once again, 10 yards and he has a Glock 19, you'd better have cover. Other than that...

Finally, I do not carry any of these calibers now (22 or 25 variants), but I think the gun in your post looks really nice. That being said, with new ammo coming out for LCPs and the gun cost being dirt cheap, and the gun being super small, unless you're wearing speedos not sure how much further into deep concealment one would have to be to move to a 25!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
+1 for that, .25 pistols are bordering on collectibles or "toys" for pocket mouse gun collectors. If you've never handled a Baby Browning, this thing is so small I would be afraid to lose it:)

My .22 lr NAA mini revolver with the 1 1/8" barrel is about as small as it gets, with only the .22 short model being smaller (speaking of useless for defense, I won't even get started on .22 short:)). I carry mine in an empty pack of cigarellos.

The mini Berettas are definitely defensive guns, as in, you're getting the crap knocked out of you or are being tackled from behind and you need something to jam in the bad guys stomach and pump a few rounds in so you can escape, aka the "get off me" gun.....or like was said, into the face or temple of a bad guy, take the gun out before the bad guy knows what you're doing and load his face with .25 slugs.....would be decently effective.

To further muddy the waters of defensive micro guns, NAA has the ".25 NAA" pistol and they designed the necked down .32 case with a .25 slug in it. It's a small pistol, about as big as the Bobcat with a little more punch.

I would rather carry a snub revolver loaded with .38 +P but it's not always possible......there are times when I'm just running out for a few hours and I need something I can put behind my wallet in a pair of cargo shorts.

I do want to get a Ruger LCP, I have handled these and they are small and light.........I have a feeling that one of these loaded with a nice .380 defense load, will turn my .25 Bobcats into "range toys" and I will no longer carry them. I'm one of those wierdos who actually enjoys shooting the tiny little .25's and .32's, though. Not many people do more with these than run a mag or two through them and then carry them.
 

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I completely understand the need for something smaller. My Shield is small and thin but I still consider it a 'holster' gun. S&W J frame fits in my pocket, but not ALL my pockets...especially when wearing shorts that I lounge around in, and I'm just running to the store and back.

I have been considering an LCP for quite a while now for the exact same reasons the OP is looking at mouse guns. Sometimes the smallest gun you own, just isn't small enough.
 

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I too happen to own a .25ACP "mouse gun"
When it was designed, it was a "vest pocket pistol" for a gentleman to carry in his vest for a night out. Now, if I were to carry this 80 year old gun, it would be as a last ditch effort to repel a bad guy, and if a .40S&W can't do that, then I don't think the .25 would be much more than a noise maker.

The minimum cartridge I carry is the .32 ACP. I switch back and forth between my Kel-Tec P32 and the Ruger LCP. I also have another Beretta 32, it isn't a pocket gun, but would be fine for a IWB carry.

Anyway, I digress, here is the little cap gun:

 

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If the pistols has sentimental value get it. If not I would not recommend it but not for the same reasons already stated. If you want a small pocket revolver I would recommend the Beretta 21A. Its similar to the 25ACP but shoots cheaper ammo and has almost the same energy. The biggest problem with these is limp wristing.

As far as stopping power you already know that and can make up your own mind if that is enough.
 

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As far as I am concerned the .25 cal is the moot point. That gun is the worst POS to have your life depend on.

Look at it and you will discover it has no extractor in the design. It depends entirely on the powder expansion to eject the shell. WHEN it jams racking the slide does nothing,you are now dead because the shell is stuck in it.

When I was at my CCW class a poor woman was trying to qualify with this jam-o-matic. It jamed on every shot followed by the instructor and a knife to get the spent shell out.

I cannot believe this design has been out that long and people still buy them for that easy to chamber tip up barrel. Pick something else,anything else. Both Berretta and the Brazillian Taurus sell this same POS.
 

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As far as I am concerned the .25 cal is the moot point. That gun is the worst POS to have your life depend on.

Look at it and you will discover it has no extractor in the design. It depends entirely on the powder expansion to eject the shell. WHEN it jams racking the slide does nothing,you are now dead because the shell is stuck in it.

When I was at my CCW class a poor woman was trying to qualify with this jam-o-matic. It jamed on every shot followed by the instructor and a knife to get the spent shell out.

I cannot believe this design has been out that long and people still buy them for that easy to chamber tip up barrel. Pick something else,anything else. Both Berretta and the Brazillian Taurus sell this same POS.
Wasn't the origional James Bond pistol a Berretta 25ACP? In the very first movie he complains about it jamming and Q gives him the Walther PPK.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Yes, the same pistol in DDelambre's post:)

I recall that Bond was attached to it and reluctantly had to give it up for the PPK .32. He even tries to leave with the Beretta but M catches him (IIRC):D
 
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