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Old guys guys know about old guns.

This is a S&W Model 469 from the mid-80's. It came with a 12rd 9mm magazine to this photo shoot but any 5900 series mag slips right in with 19 or 20 round capacity.
Lightweight alloy frame with good sights that's cop service pistol reliability. It is the original "Wonder 9". With the 12 round mag equipped with a flat base plate it can be comfortably carried in the front pocket of cargo pants

At the risk of being "non-political" nobody owes anybody an explanation why a pistol like this has always been necessary.

But here is the deal. New pistols replace old pistols. That's the advertising and merchandising end of firearms marketing. Smith and Wesson stopped making these pistols 30 years ago. They are not plastic. They are not striker fired. But what they are is rugged, reliable, and probably the last to go off the shelf in a panic buying spree like we are seeing right now. Why? because old guys like me have not been telling you about them. Why? because you are busy reading about the latest plastic pistol with your heart set on it.....hey, I can dig it.
 

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I can appreciate those old metal smith&wessons.....they are classic. I have a marlin Camp 9 carbine . It takes those smith&wesson magazines from the 1980's. (10/12/14/15/20 rounds ) I've been searching for a nice 59/69 series pistol to match, it's been difficult. They are not for sale anywhere. Other People must like them too ?
 

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Viceroy 🟩🟩🟩
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Discussion Starter #63
Those old, metal frame, original Wonder Nines are great.

I’m racking my brain to remember who still makes that type of steel or aluminum frame DA/SA auto like were all the rage in the 1980s. The Beretta 92 strikes me as the prime example. And the CZ 75.
 

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Those old, metal frame, original Wonder Nines are great.

I’m racking my brain to remember who still makes that type of steel or aluminum frame DA/SA auto like were all the rage in the 1980s. The Beretta 92 strikes me as the prime example. And the CZ 75.
The SIG P226, and its offspring the P228, P229/M11.
SIG like Ruger, S&W, CZ and Beretta, was slow to get into the plastic-framed business.
That may have been due to some Gaston Glock patents, or a decision to ride the existing technology for as long as possible, seeking to maximize return-on-investment.
There's a chance "both" is the answer.
 

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I lean toward a Gen5 Glock 26 for magazine compatibility and carry a spare 15 round mag often a little lcp is along for the ride just in case
 

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EXACTLY!!!
I love my revolvers and I reload 38 special and 357. When I go to the range I find the Semi-auto boring (just me, I know). So since I never shot my two 9MMs I sold them thinking - I don't like shooting it, I never carry it and if I sell them AND the Ammo then I can buy another revolver! I carry an LCR 357/38 and since I'm really comfortable shooting and shoot it well. I figured that five great shots will settle anything I might get into and I was willing to take my chances. But things have changed! Last month I got a CZ-P07 and bought the 9mm dies to reload. I like it, but I still want to shoot the revolvers and I still carry the LCR five days a week. But on those days where I could be in a bigger crowd or going to a part of town that I feel a little less comfortable. Having 14+1 and shooting that well is comforting. So as to the original point of the OP, I agree!
 

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Agree with you all.
Especially today when I took my P93 dc out and gave it a good work out with 100 rounds.
Still carry it sometimes. Use a Remora iwb and carry an additional. 15 round mag.
This was the last of the all metal P series I believe.
 

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"The Real Deal"
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Agree with you all.
Especially today when I took my P93 dc out and gave it a good work out with 100 rounds.
Still carry it sometimes. Use a Remora iwb and carry an additional. 15 round mag.
This was the last of the all metal P series I believe.
Good choice, the 94 or 944 was the last all metal p series. sane size as the 93 but 94 was 9mm and 944 was 40sw. The 95 went to the polymer lower, then the 97,and 345. Still good pistols. I perfer all metal.
 

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Folks,
This is a good thread.
May I remind everyone here that guns and ammo aren't everything - and I know you all know that - please don't neglect building a good First Aid kit and gunshot blowout kit, and training and practice.
NEVER use your real-world tourniquets and bandage dressings as training items; purchase extras that you can dedicate for practice.
ALSO a good training technique: Look up to know how much blood a person can lose before being too far gone. Fill a container with that much colored water. Purchase an outboard motor fuel bulb and some tubing to simulate an "artery." With your container of fluid, tubing, and fuel bulb, you can create a simulated circulatory system that you can run down the "victims" arm or leg. 1 person will be the bulb squeezer, 1 person the responder, 1 person the victim. The responder must be able to emplace the tourniquet and get the bleeding stopped before the fluid runs out. On your mark, get set, GO. Squeezer squeezes, Responder responds, and Victim screams his/her fool head off. Rotate and trade places. Everybody must be able to do it effectively and confidently. There will be a learning curve, and tourniquets hurt like hell when they are properly applied. And, you'll get an idea how much blood that is. Go to the Salvation Army for clothes you won't mind cutting up and ruining. You also have to learn how to apply a tourniquet to yourself, and one-handed.
Also, look into hemostatic dressings like Nustat tactical dressing.
Chest seals, and how to deal with chest wounds - pneumothorax...
You get the idea.

Now, for the fun stuff...

My daily carry piece since the mid-'90s has been a Para Ordnance P13, and an extra mag loaded with 12 rounds of Remington Golden Saber (I still have 2 boxes of Black Talon).

When I travel with the family, depending on where we go, I plan to pack along my M4 with extra mags; Mossberg 590 with a rifled slug ammo pouch and a #1 Buckshot ammo pouch; Glock 17 loaded with 147 gr JHPs, and extra mags; Para Ord P13 loaded with 230gr Golden Sabers with extra mags; First Aid/blowout kit.

At home (in town, a quiet suburban neighborhood) we have plenty of slugs and buckshot for the two 20ga and the 12ga. If things get really sporty, the shotguns will be the primaries and pistols as backup.

1qt canteen pouches are sufficient in a pinch to hold shotshells.

Residents are in the process of making a plan to secure our neighborhood's entrance points in case rioters decide to come our way.
 

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At times like this I am sorry that I lost my guns in a boating accident. But life happens and we can always talk the bad guys down or have a social worker defuse any situation. That's my 2 cents.

In case you can't tell that was sarcasm.
 

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View attachment 144583

Old guys guys know about old guns.

This is a S&W Model 469 from the mid-80's. It came with a 12rd 9mm magazine to this photo shoot but any 5900 series mag slips right in with 19 or 20 round capacity.
Lightweight alloy frame with good sights that's cop service pistol reliability. It is the original "Wonder 9". With the 12 round mag equipped with a flat base plate it can be comfortably carried in the front pocket of cargo pants

At the risk of being "non-political" nobody owes anybody an explanation why a pistol like this has always been necessary.

But here is the deal. New pistols replace old pistols. That's the advertising and merchandising end of firearms marketing. Smith and Wesson stopped making these pistols 30 years ago. They are not plastic. They are not striker fired. But what they are is rugged, reliable, and probably the last to go off the shelf in a panic buying spree like we are seeing right now. Why? because old guys like me have not been telling you about them. Why? because you are busy reading about the latest plastic pistol with your heart set on it.....hey, I can dig it.

My 469 was my primary carry and eventually the 'go to' truck gun for many years. Got away from it as a G 22 took over for truck duty. I had recently been carrying a S&W 3914 when I wanted something lighter than the 1911. Perhaps the 469 should take over for the 3914?

Bruce
 

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"The Real Deal"
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Folks,
This is a good thread.
May I remind everyone here that guns and ammo aren't everything - and I know you all know that - please don't neglect building a good First Aid kit and gunshot blowout kit, and training and practice.
NEVER use your real-world tourniquets and bandage dressings as training items; purchase extras that you can dedicate for practice.
ALSO a good training technique: Look up to know how much blood a person can lose before being too far gone. Fill a container with that much colored water. Purchase an outboard motor fuel bulb and some tubing to simulate an "artery." With your container of fluid, tubing, and fuel bulb, you can create a simulated circulatory system that you can run down the "victims" arm or leg. 1 person will be the bulb squeezer, 1 person the responder, 1 person the victim. The responder must be able to emplace the tourniquet and get the bleeding stopped before the fluid runs out. On your mark, get set, GO. Squeezer squeezes, Responder responds, and Victim screams his/her fool head off. Rotate and trade places. Everybody must be able to do it effectively and confidently. There will be a learning curve, and tourniquets hurt like hell when they are properly applied. And, you'll get an idea how much blood that is. Go to the Salvation Army for clothes you won't mind cutting up and ruining. You also have to learn how to apply a tourniquet to yourself, and one-handed.
Also, look into hemostatic dressings like Nustat tactical dressing.
Chest seals, and how to deal with chest wounds - pneumothorax...
You get the idea.

Now, for the fun stuff...

My daily carry piece since the mid-'90s has been a Para Ordnance P13, and an extra mag loaded with 12 rounds of Remington Golden Saber (I still have 2 boxes of Black Talon).

When I travel with the family, depending on where we go, I plan to pack along my M4 with extra mags; Mossberg 590 with a rifled slug ammo pouch and a #1 Buckshot ammo pouch; Glock 17 loaded with 147 gr JHPs, and extra mags; Para Ord P13 loaded with 230gr Golden Sabers with extra mags; First Aid/blowout kit.

At home (in town, a quiet suburban neighborhood) we have plenty of slugs and buckshot for the two 20ga and the 12ga. If things get really sporty, the shotguns will be the primaries and pistols as backup.

1qt canteen pouches are sufficient in a pinch to hold shotshells.

Residents are in the process of making a plan to secure our neighborhood's entrance points in case rioters decide to come our way.
Took a class on that stuff, alot of the guys on the rigs carry torniquets for themselves just in case. Learned to pack gunshot wounds, it was a great skill not really covered in depth in emt basic course. Great info. Hope i never need it.
 

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As mentioned elsewhere, anyone here who was around in the mid 60's thru early 70's has seen all this before. I hesitate to say it was worse back then in deference to the people who are stuck in the middle of the current unrest. Being retired, I stay away from anywhere trouble might foment and, thank goodness, there hasn't been any violence around here. Should that change for the worst, I'm not changing my EDC, (Shield 45), I'll be dialing AR-15.
 

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I still have my 9mm Shield as my EDC but recently purchased and AR but 5.56 ammo is hard to find nowadays. Or if you can its really expensive. My shotgun also came out of the safe and is ready for action if needed.
Anyone else having trouble finding 5.56?
 

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I still have my 9mm Shield as my EDC but recently purchased and AR but 5.56 ammo is hard to find nowadays. Or if you can its really expensive. My shotgun also came out of the safe and is ready for action if needed.
Anyone else having trouble finding 5.56?
I haven't been looking lately, but SGAmmo has a couple of options in stock. They still have a few cases of the Win 62-gr OTM ammo with purple brass

 

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I still have my 9mm Shield as my EDC but recently purchased and AR but 5.56 ammo is hard to find nowadays. Or if you can its really expensive. My shotgun also came out of the safe and is ready for action if needed.
Anyone else having trouble finding 5.56?
gunbot.net and ammoseek are good sites for finding ammo.
 
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