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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hello,

I am new to the AR style rifles. This is my first one. Well my second technically because my first one had to go back to Ruger and wasreplaced. This is my replacement rifle I just received. Being new to these styles of rifles I am unsure about what is acceptable and what isn't when it comes to tolerances and gaps etc... I have noticed on my new MPR that I can see right through between the upper and lower. And in the rear of the rifle there is a pretty large gap. Is this normal? I tried to get the best picture I could take and one of the pics used a flash light to further show what I am talking about. The other issues I am concerned with is the gas tube seems to be loose, When I pick the rifle up it freely moves around and rattles or I can move it with my finger. The last thing I would say I am more disappointed in and not so much a potential problem is Ruger sent me this replacement rifle and it is DIRTY. Its caked on the inside of the rifle. I am guessing they test fired it and not cleaned it at all? I completely understand that I can clean it and I will, I just would have thought a "new replacement" would have been a bit cleaner than this. I have other Ruger rifles and firearms and never had one sent to me dirty like this Pics attached . I don't want to seem like I am nit picking by any means. Just want some opinions on if this is normal or an acceptable replacement they sent me?

Thank you.

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Emperor
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It is pretty common to have gaps between the upper and lower receivers of an AR type rifle or carbine.
 

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Personally, that gap looks excessive. I have several ARs, including a 556TD. A few of them I also assembled myself from non-matched receiver sets. None of them, including the Ruger exhibit any significant gaps.

As long as the bolt carrier isn't impeded when traversing rearward into the buffer tube, you should be fine functionally. Aesthetics is subjective, and I wouldn't settle for that. Additionally, large gaps between the receivers could potentially allow more dirt and debris in which could lead to malfunctions.

I would ask Ruger to replace either the upper or lower until they have one that fits perfectly.

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Hirschjäger
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I'm no AR expert, but that gap does seem excessive. I'm far from fussy, but I'd definitely send them photos to see about returning it...as much as it sucks to have to do that with a replacement rifle...

As for the gas tube, keep in mind that they are only held in place with a single roll pin in the gas block and the hole through which they are passed in the upper receiver. I don't recall how loose mine are (AR556 and a custom build).

As for the dirt on a new Ruger firearm...they slather their firearms with a preservative (not lubricant) that may or may not be cleaned off by the seller. Mine came all gooped up with the stuff. that's why you'll see us here always advise any new gun owner to clean their rifles before getting worried about malfunctions. More than one new AR556 user has reported having issues that were remedied by their cleaning out the gunk...

Good luck with the rifle.

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Discussion Starter #7
OK thanks for the replies. I sent a email to ruger today along with the pictures asking them about it. It will indeed suck if I have to send it back. This is technically the third replacement. The first rifle had tool marks all over it and was out of spec and had to be destroyed. The replacement to that got sent to a closed store and was held.
 

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I had a similar story, but with a Ruger SR-762. Cosmetically it was fine, but the upper was out of spec causing the gun to run out of elevation adjustment at 100 yards and shoot very low. After 3 trips and 2 replacements, they ended up cutting me a refund check.

Point is, sometimes Ruger makes a lemon. Sometimes they make whole barrels of lemonade. They will make it right for you one way or another though.

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"The Real Deal"
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Well, i am very familiar to the ar platform. kinda known for it. My opinion the gap is way to much at the rear which i have never seen one that bad, and ive seen alot. Most budget ar's are loose fitting, but niot that loose. Problem you will face is to get a tight fit between the upper and lowrer will require them to be eyeballed or hand selected. Thats how match receivers are sold as pairs. Its unlikely they will take the time to do that, just dont see it.

My thoughts if they end up refunding you, put a few extra dollars with it and purchase a rock river arms ar, i have several and all are tight fitting, better trigger and no issues. Probably one of the best choices, no worries. Dpms, bushmaster, delton, and several others are great choices as well. Just my opinion.
 

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DPMS and Bushmaster are no more. I wouldn't recommend them anyway after they were bought out and managed by Remington. Quality control really fell and their warranty policies mediocre at best. Similar what happened to Colt after their fall from glory.

Windham, comprised of the former Bushmaster guys do make excellent rifles. They're a tier 2 outfit in my opinion and compete well in the mid-range market. All of their ARs chambered in 556 feature 41v50 chrome-lined barrels and carpenter 158 bolts. I would recommend them to new owners in a heartbeat. They also back their rifles with a transferable and lifetime warranty.

The tier 1 stuff I would consider boutique assemblers like DD, LWRC, POF, etc but are obviously going to be much more expensive.

RRA and Del-ton are focused more on the budget end of the spectrum. I've seen and handled a few. Most were decent shooters but you get what you pay for in terms of barrel and bolt material, etc.

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DPMS and Bushmaster are no more. I wouldn't recommend them anyway after they were bought out and managed by Remington. Quality control really fell and their warranty policies mediocre at best. Similar what happened to Colt after their fall from glory.

Windham, comprised of the former Bushmaster guys do make excellent rifles. They're a tier 2 outfit in my opinion and compete well in the mid-range market. All of their ARs chambered in 556 feature 41v50 chrome-lined barrels and carpenter 158 bolts. I would recommend them to new owners in a heartbeat. They also back their rifles with a transferable and lifetime warranty.

The tier 1 stuff I would consider boutique assemblers like DD, LWRC, POF, etc but are obviously going to be much more expensive.

RRA and Del-ton are focused more on the budget end of the spectrum. I've seen and handled a few. Most were decent shooters but you get what you pay for in terms of barrel and bolt material, etc.

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You do know that dpms is the largest producer of ar stoner rifles in the US, and supplies the government, has for many years? Defense Procurement Manufacturing Services?

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but from owning dpms, bushmaster, rock river, colt, armalite, delton, fulton armory. anderson and others, none of those are bad choices.

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Yes, I know who DPMS was. I've owned several. But as I said, DPMS as a brand is gone. I'm surprised you as a self proclaimed expert didn't know that.

And no, DPMS wasn't ever one of the largest AR suppliers in the US. Don't know where you got that from, but it's not accurate.

The real DPMS died the day the Freedom Group bought them.

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Yes, I know who DPMS was. I've owned several. But as I said, DPMS as a brand is gone. I'm surprised you as a self proclaimed expert didn't know that.

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I didnt proclaim anything, but it seems everyone on the internet is an expert nowdays because they own this or that or have played too many video games. If thats your belief than maybe this is not the forum for you. Im sure you will fit in just fine over at AR15.com.

Everyone is entitled to decide what choices they make, what they buy, and what they believe. I believe they should have all the information to make a wise decision. If dpms is gone as you spout, their are still millions of rifles and parts for sale that are quality firearms with a panther logo on them in circulation. Thats a fact. Same as with bushmaster its sister company. They are in my opinion better than the budget ar556. Search the ar556 and the numerous issues posted about them on the web, or guys shooting them at the firing range. Compare that to the other makers and things can be rationalized. The OP deserves all the honest, truthful information he can get since the guy behind the counter is trying ti get your money, and many online have the assumption that if the seals arent using it, its crap.

I do believe i can give honest no bs opinions on ar rifles of many makers without touting this maker is the end all be all forever. Owning, reloading for, shooting, building, and researching them for many years has afforded me that. If that offends you I apologize. The picture i posted is to show im not one of those individuals basing experience on things i don't know anything about and proves i have a little experience to share.
 
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Thanks everyone for the comments and information regarding my issue. I guess for me best case scenario would be to get a refund. I not only have had three of these be replaced so far I believe I might paid to much ontop of that. I ended up paying around $800 for the regular free floating handguard rifle (came out of the box with tool marks and numerous blemishes) at a LGS and another $30-40 for ffls fees for the replacement. It is in part my fault for not doing my research and pricing before I bought this. I was trying to support a local gun store and give them my business during this whole pandemic going on.

After almost a month and a half and my replacement being held at the LGS without any word of if or when I could ever pick it up and numerous calls to ruger I finally got ahold of the manager at ruger he sent me a mpr due to all the issues I had experienced. And now this is where I'm at. I feel for something I paid $800+ for should be a little better quality and the fit and finish could be better.

That said. If I did get a refund (doubtful but I guess I'll wait and see) I have been doing some research and my budget is around $900 give or take a little. I have been looking at windham weaponry, Sig Sauer m400 tread, core 15 rifle, rock river arms rrage, armalite eagle ar, mp15 sport ii. These seem to be in my price range and have good reviews online.
 

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That gap is waaaay to big and I don't think I'd take the risk shooting it. That IS the worst I have ever seen on ANY of the lower end ARs, that is way beyond being just a sloppy fit (fairly normal for some lower end ARs being "loose fit"). The bolt should hit the buffer and recoil spring straight on, NOT at that angle.

The "goop" is storage lube applied at the factory for storage reasons, who knows how long it will sit in a warehouse and under what temperature and climate conditions before it reaches the LGS.

Like Tacky, I'm not new to ARs.

I also have my share of low-end name brands (all run just fine), a few high-end brand names, home builds, no issues with Rock River, Colt or BCM. But my weapons of choice are Danial Defense or BCM. Hand built and zero slop, but I also paid for it.

Another thing(s) I never do is buy sight unseen or later productions, I want first run made with new tooling. I like to FULLY inspect what I'm getting and later runs seem to get sloppier as they are produced as the tooling starts ageing.
 
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Thanks everyone for the comments and information regarding my issue. I guess for me best case scenario would be to get a refund. I not only have had three of these be replaced so far I believe I might paid to much ontop of that. I ended up paying around $800 for the regular free floating handguard rifle (came out of the box with tool marks and numerous blemishes) at a LGS and another $30-40 for ffls fees for the replacement. It is in part my fault for not doing my research and pricing before I bought this. I was trying to support a local gun store and give them my business during this whole pandemic going on.

After almost a month and a half and my replacement being held at the LGS without any word of if or when I could ever pick it up and numerous calls to ruger I finally got ahold of the manager at ruger he sent me a mpr due to all the issues I had experienced. And now this is where I'm at. I feel for something I paid $800+ for should be a little better quality and the fit and finish could be better.

That said. If I did get a refund (doubtful but I guess I'll wait and see) I have been doing some research and my budget is around $900 give or take a little. I have been looking at windham weaponry, Sig Sauer m400 tread, core 15 rifle, rock river arms rrage, armalite eagle ar, mp15 sport ii. These seem to be in my price range and have good reviews online.
I'd change your LGS for dragging their feet. They should have handled the problem(s) right away. I'd also suggest, inspect it BEFORE you lay down the cash and walk if you aren't happy with the product.

The S&W M&P Sport has a good reputation, product support and a lifetime warrantee. I have the original M&P Sport, M&P "T" (free float barrel) bought way before Ruger started making them. Had zero issues with my original AR556 or SR556 when they finely came out.

Good luck and stay safe.
 
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Idk, Op. Pics are deceiving. Not saying you're trying be deceptive just that the optics are what they are.

I have a very nice fitting, 'tight', LMT AR. If I turn it at just the right angle....yep, looks like a big gap. Can't get a piece of paper to fit in that gap though. In a pic though....it looks HUGE.

To me it looks like the 'j' in the rear is not machined correctly....causing the entire gap. I have a 'gap' on the flat, not on the 'j'….if that makes sense.

Measurements would probably help. A feeler gauge would be perfect. Idk what the spec is but it does look different.
 

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Yea I won't ever be going to that LGS ever again. The way they treated me and basically told me not their problem was disheartening. Also this was a special order item. I actually had to pay for it before I even got to look at it. My fault on that one. I thought I wouldn't have had any issues.

As for the gap. I'm trying to show the gap the best way I can. It's definitely there. I'm definitely not all trying to be deceiving. Size wise it's more like a dime size gap. I will see if I have a feeler gauge and test it with that.
 

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Thanks everyone for the comments and information regarding my issue. I guess for me best case scenario would be to get a refund. I not only have had three of these be replaced so far I believe I might paid to much ontop of that. I ended up paying around $800 for the regular free floating handguard rifle (came out of the box with tool marks and numerous blemishes) at a LGS and another $30-40 for ffls fees for the replacement. It is in part my fault for not doing my research and pricing before I bought this. I was trying to support a local gun store and give them my business during this whole pandemic going on.

After almost a month and a half and my replacement being held at the LGS without any word of if or when I could ever pick it up and numerous calls to ruger I finally got ahold of the manager at ruger he sent me a mpr due to all the issues I had experienced. And now this is where I'm at. I feel for something I paid $800+ for should be a little better quality and the fit and finish could be better.

That said. If I did get a refund (doubtful but I guess I'll wait and see) I have been doing some research and my budget is around $900 give or take a little. I have been looking at windham weaponry, Sig Sauer m400 tread, core 15 rifle, rock river arms rrage, armalite eagle ar, mp15 sport ii. These seem to be in my price range and have good reviews online.
Nothing wrong with considering your options. In the $900 range you have many options. Look hard at the rock river. the make some great rifles, and already have a 2 stage 3.5lb trigger. Look at the deltons, they are made in my home state maybe an hour or two from me. I have used their barrels and producded under 1" at 100 yards with iron sights. They make an awesome dissipator, probably best around. S&W mp is a good rifle too, and affordable. Only problem i have seen with them is the set screw mounted gas block can work loose but thats an easy fix with rocksett. Only seen that one time. Don't forget dpns, bushmaster, olympic arms, aero precision, springfield armory saint and im sure im forgetting others. Bear creek arsenal could be a possibility. All of these follow the milspec pattern.

Biggest thing stay away from polymer lowers, the are prone to cracking prematurely either at the rear takedown pin or where the buffer tube attaches.

If you find sonething you like, lets us know and we will try to give you some advice.
 
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I'm going to be devil's advocate here and say - the gun is fine. Shoot it. Enjoy it. Don't worry about the gap. They almost all have a gap. How big is too big? If your bolt carrier can't go into the buffer tube due to the misalignment, then it's too much. (HINT - Your gun is going to be fine in this regard.)

Can you do something about it? Well, you can contact Ruger and go through all "that" again. Or, you can try some of these tips to take out the slack and allow you to enjoy your rifle.

Seriously, whatever YOU want to do is fine. It's YOUR gun. You need to be happy with it. If you just want to shoot it and have fun and enjoy playing with an AR, your gun is fine for that. It's not 'Match Tight', but you never said you wanted to go shoot competitively so...go shoot for fun and enjoy it!
 
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