[Bepe]

The 9mm PCC doesn't enjoy the huge velocity gain in comparison to the .357 or .44 Magnum cartridges. There was an interesting post a month or so back in which it showed a You Tube with velocity comparison between a number of different 9mm rounds and barrel lengths. I forget where it was posted.

Seems the sweet spot barrel length for the 9mm is around the 10 inch mark. A slight velocity gain out of a 16 inch barrel with the 115 and 124 bullets. I think the 147 grainers actually lost velocity.

That Banshee is a very popular firearm. I've watched You Tubes where it consistently hit steel targets and 200 yards. I think you are going to be very happy once familiarized.

Bepe

 

[Bill837]

The 9mm PCC doesn't enjoy the huge velocity gain in comparison to the .357 or .44 Magnum cartridges. There was an interesting post a month or so back in which it showed a You Tube with velocity comparison between a number of different 9mm rounds and barrel lengths. I forget where it was posted.

Seems the sweet spot barrel length for the 9mm is around the 10 inch mark. A slight velocity gain out of a 16 inch barrel with the 115 and 124 bullets. I think the 147 grainers actually lost velocity.

That Banshee is a very popular firearm. I've watched You Tubes where it consistently hit steel targets and 200 yards. I think you are going to be very happy once familiarized.

Bepe

I think that sounds right and jives with the BBtheI data.

You are right about me liking the Banshee. I ordered a few of those foam covers for the pistol tube and might experiment with some plastic bags and expanding foam to see if I can create a shallow cradle for a cheek weld on the tube.

I pulled the extractor to clean things up and see how it looks. I sure hope it uses only the o-ring for tension, because I lost the spring if it had both. I reassembled it and it feels about the same as it did before I pushed the pin out the first time, so pretty sure it is a donut only setup. I did look at those tuning kits on their website and in one video they showed a 45 Auto version and it had a spring and no donut, so we shall see.

 

[Redhawk100]

I did look at those tuning kits on their website and in one video they showed a 45 Auto version and it had a spring and no donut, so we shall see.

Holeeeee CA-RAP! You mentioned .45 ACP, so I thought I'd wander over to their site to see about a carbine, and those cost what a Galil Ace costs. Oof! I can handle the price, but it's at a level that would require the kind of approval the wife would not grant right now. In light of the liberties I took to get my last two pistols, I won't push it by trying to slide one of those in through the back door.

By the way, the site refers to the system as a "rotary delayed blow-back system," so our theory about the angled surfaces on the back of the bolt lugs was right.

 

[baltimoreed]

After the brace ruling I moved my nice brace/CNC lower to the 16 inch cmmg .45 that I had built. Very accurate rifle. But the brace looks better on my faux MP5.

 

[Bepe]

Holeeeee CA-RAP! You mentioned .45 ACP, so I thought I'd wander over to their site to see about a carbine, and those cost what a Galil Ace costs. Oof! I can handle the price, but it's at a level that would require the kind of approval the wife would not grant right now.

RH.......My CMMG tale of woe is getting old, but I feel a need to issue a word of caution before making a purchase of the .45 auto version. I had the 16" barrel Resolute and it suffered from a severe case of barrel whip. The barrel was paper thin. When you punched a brass brush through it it sang like you were scraping a beer can. Shot 10" low left for one shot......then 10" high right for the next. Two shots later....in the x ring.

I tested 2 different RMR's and my Leupold scope on it thinking it might be an optic issue. CMMG wouldn't do squat and told me to eat it. Check their web site closely on a disclaimer. They told me that they have a disclamer that the .45 was only accurate with "premium" ammo.....IE Speer Gold Dots or Federal HST. I tried both and no improvement over ball ammo. The Resolute went down the road for less than half of what I paid.

BaltimoreEd states his .45 auto CMMG barrels shoot accurate. A shorter pistol length barrel might have good harmonics. I'd like to get a hands on with his 16" barrel and give it a look over.

Just a caution...... Good luck with your decision.
Bepe

 

[Bill837]

RH.......My CMMG tale of woe is getting old, but I feel a need to issue a word of caution before making a purchase of the .45 auto version. I had the 16" barrel Resolute and it suffered from a severe case of barrel whip. The barrel was paper thin. When you punched a brass brush through it it sang like you were scraping a beer can. Shot 10" low left for one shot......then 10" high right for the next. Two shots later....in the x ring.

I tested 2 different RMR's and my Leupold scope on it thinking it might be an optic issue. CMMG wouldn't do squat and told me to eat it. Check their web site closely on a disclaimer. They told me that they have a disclamer that the .45 was only accurate with "premium" ammo.....IE Speer Gold Dots or Federal HST. I tried both and no improvement over ball ammo. The Resolute went down the road for less than half of what I paid.

BaltimoreEd states his .45 auto CMMG barrels shoot accurate. A shorter pistol length barrel might have good harmonics. I'd like to get a hands on with his 16" barrel and give it a look over.

Just a caution...... Good luck with your decision.
Bepe

We will get to get another data point on the CMMG CS. I sent a message to them telling them my extractor didn't have a spring, just a donut. I have watched two YouTube clips of guys having FTE's with their Banshee 9mm MkGS and both had to replace the worn spring in their extractor with a BCM kit. Neither had a donut.

 

[Redhawk100]

RH.......My CMMG tale of woe is getting old, but I feel a need to issue a word of caution before making a purchase of the .45 auto version. I had the 16" barrel Resolute and it suffered from a severe case of barrel whip. The barrel was paper thin. When you punched a brass brush through it it sang like you were scraping a beer can. Shot 10" low left for one shot......then 10" high right for the next. Two shots later....in the x ring.

I tested 2 different RMR's and my Leupold scope on it thinking it might be an optic issue. CMMG wouldn't do squat and told me to eat it. Check their web site closely on a disclaimer. They told me that they have a disclamer that the .45 was only accurate with "premium" ammo.....IE Speer Gold Dots or Federal HST. I tried both and no improvement over ball ammo. The Resolute went down the road for less than half of what I paid.

BaltimoreEd states his .45 auto CMMG barrels shoot accurate. A shorter pistol length barrel might have good harmonics. I'd like to get a hands on with his 16" barrel and give it a look over.

Just a caution...... Good luck with your decision.
Bepe

Thanks for the heads-up. I can't say that premium ammo will make a PCC shoot much better than standard FMJ out of a .45 ACP carbine, so I don't buy what they told you. Your theory about barrel thinness and resulting barrel whip is more than plausible. I wonder if CMMG got so many reports like yours that they fixed the problem by either thickening the barrel or using a different muzzle device to clean up the harmonics.

 

[Bepe]

Bill.......overcast and foggy @40 degrees. Got to rake the leaves but decided to get a couple pics while waiting for it to clear a bit.

About 500 rounds on the AR9. Some mating wear on both sides of the gas key. Front lip where the charging handle contacts. Charging handle looks good with minimal wear. The bolt carrier shows virtually nothing for wear with the underside looking good also.

The bolt disassembly on the Rock River is simply a matter of removing the firing pin. The pin is spring loaded. No other moving parts. You can see the weight installed in the rear of the carrier. I believe it is a 1/4" roll pin. The CMMG weight kit is identical.

Bepe

 

[Bepe]

Neither had a donut.

Bill...you referring to the D shaped pad that is commonly under the extractors?

Bepe

 

[Bepe]

Thanks for the heads-up. I can't say that premium ammo will make a PCC shoot much better than standard FMJ out of a .45 ACP carbine, so I don't buy what they told you. Your theory about barrel thinness and resulting barrel whip is more than plausible. I wonder if CMMG got so many reports like yours that they fixed the problem by either thickening the barrel or using a different muzzle device to clean up the harmonics.

RH.....if you only knew the entire story. I'm not going into it again. I will say that for a "top echelon" gun company like CMMG I was absolutely astounded on how they handled my claim and the statements they made.

You may be 100% right in the muzzle device change I have noticed pics of the current are different than what I had.

Bepe

 

[Redhawk100]

RH.....if you only knew the entire story. I'm not going into it again. I will say that for a "top echelon" gun company like CMMG I was absolutely astounded on how they handled my claim.

You may be 100% right in the muzzle device change I have noticed pics of the current are different than what I had.

Bepe

I would have been horrified, too. A high-dollar premium brand should deliver premium customer service, too.

 

[Bill837]

Bill...you referring to the D shaped pad that is commonly under the extractors?

Bepe

No, not a D ring but similar. guys use a rubber o ring in addition to an extractor spring, the spring goes up through the o ring and acts as a helper.

I think I got the o ring “donut” but no spring.

 

[maddmatter1970]

RH.....if you only knew the entire story. I'm not going into it again. I will say that for a "top echelon" gun company like CMMG I was absolutely astounded on how they handled my claim and the statements they made.

You may be 100% right in the muzzle device change I have noticed pics of the current are different than what I had.

Bepe

That's like me and Beretta. I will, and in fact cannot due to honor ever buy another thing from Beretta. I will and have told people that a 92fs or any m9 variant is a well made pistol. I hold no grudge. I just cant give them my money and have to tell people that beretta is a communist multi country company whose ideas and methods are in opposition to freedom, and therefore me. And I cannot vote for them with my business. I vote for American companies like Ruger, S&W, CMMG, Anderson, BA barrels, etc that are in line with my thoughts.

 

[Bill837]

That's like me and Beretta. I will, and in fact cannot due to honor ever buy another thing from Beretta. I will and have told people that a 92fs or any m9 variant is a well made pistol. I hold no grudge. I just cant give them my money and have to tell people that beretta is a communist multi country company whose ideas and methods are in opposition to freedom, and therefore me. And I cannot vote for them with my business. I vote for American companies like Ruger, S&W, CMMG, Anderson, BA barrels, etc that are in line with my thoughts.

I don't think that is widely known, at least, I didn't know it. I lost confidence in a 92FS due to a broken locking block. The gun wasn't terribly high mileage, maybe 5000 rounds, so for me adios. But I continued to buy Beretta products over the years, mostly shotguns for upland game hunting and clay sports. I always thought they were kind of an Italian luxury brand.

 

[maddmatter1970]

I don't think that is widely known, at least, I didn't know it. I lost confidence in a 92FS due to a broken locking block. The gun wasn't terribly high mileage, maybe 5000 rounds, so for me adios. But I continued to buy Beretta products over the years, mostly shotguns for upland game hunting and clay sports. I always thought they were kind of an Italian luxury brand.

I have a beef with them is all, like Bepe does with cmmg. I believe it is my issue, I won't change my mind, but I do not want to sway others away from beretta. I just do not want anything to do with them anymore. If my 92fs dies (hahahaha it won't) I will replace with something born and bred here. And it is an Italian luxury brand!

 

[Bill837]

Bill.......overcast and foggy @40 degrees. Got to rake the leaves but decided to get a couple pics while waiting for it to clear a bit.

About 500 rounds on the AR9. Some mating wear on both sides of the gas key. Front lip where the charging handle contacts. Charging handle looks good with minimal wear. The bolt carrier shows virtually nothing for wear with the underside looking good also.

The bolt disassembly on the Rock River is simply a matter of removing the firing pin. The pin is spring loaded. No other moving parts. You can see the weight installed in the rear of the carrier. I believe it is a 1/4" roll pin. The CMMG weight kit is identical.

Bepe
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I had to laugh looking at your pictures. I finished the first pass on cleaning everything and realized, my BCG is still too dirty to get good closeups of the wear areas, but I will say, mine looks similar in the wear areas, albeit with only a few hundred rounds through the gun. My BCG is similar also in the spring loaded firing pin (that shot out when I removed the cotter key, much to my surprise).

I went ahead and ordered a BCM extractor spring kit, just in case. Midway said it will be here November 28th, so it looks like it is going by way of Mogadishu (looks like I am back on Larry's bad customer list).

CMMG got back to me this morning via email and said it absolutely has to have a spring, so I went out and scoured the floor with a flash light and found it. It had come out when I pulled the buffer (O-Ring) off and it fell on the floor. I snapped it back into the extractor and all is well. One thing I hate about the paint we put in the garage floor is it has all sorts of black and gray flecks in it making little bits extremely hard to find when they drop on it. Anyway, it looks like I got a complete gun after all.

 

[Bill837]

I have a beef with them is all, like Bepe does with cmmg. I believe it is my issue, I won't change my mind, but I do not want to sway others away from beretta. I just do not want anything to do with them anymore. If my 92fs dies (hahahaha it won't) I will replace with something born and bred here. And it is an Italian luxury brand!

Well, OK.

 

[Redhawk100]

I don't think that is widely known, at least, I didn't know it. I lost confidence in a 92FS due to a broken locking block. The gun wasn't terribly high mileage, maybe 5000 rounds, so for me adios. But I continued to buy Beretta products over the years, mostly shotguns for upland game hunting and clay sports. I always thought they were kind of an Italian luxury brand.

I was always suspicious of the locking blocks in our issued M-9s. I actually had one that every time I came back from the range with it, the locking block could fall out when I was cleaning the barrel. It never caused a functionality issue, but it still looked like a real weak point in the design to me.

 

[Bepe]

had to laugh looking at your pictures. I finished the first pass on cleaning everything and realized, my BCG is still too dirty to get good closeups of the wear areas,

The easy clean feature of the Rock River straight blowback design is a definite plus. No barrel extension with locking lugs or hard to reach feed ramps. Same goes for the bolt with its minimal parts. Minimal maintenance time adds to the joy of owning it. These rifles can get nasty fast.

Bepe

 

[maddmatter1970]

The easy clean feature of the Rock River straight blowback design is a definite plus. No barrel extension with locking lugs or hard to reach feed ramps. Same goes for the bolt with its minimal parts. Minimal maintenance time adds to the joy of owning it. These rifles can get nasty fast.

Bepe
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View attachment 212231

Blowbacks are usually dirty. Yours looks unusually clean!