[acbakken]

I think by this point we can all agree the ejector length New Vaquero in 357 will be best for OP's current needs. Load it up with stiff 180gr hardcast from Buffalo Bore or Cor Bon and you'll be fine. When funds allow and you have the ability to reload maybe consider the 45 Colt Redhawk or 454 Alaskan in the future. Either of those will offer the most power an average person will be able to control.

 

[Tater]

He's buying the gun for fun and as a last resort maybe protection from a soft and cuddly Arkansas black bear. Under that criteria any handgun will do the job, even a 22. Not well, but it's better than throwing rocks. If you want to hunt bear there are better choices but for your stated purposes I'd get a 357 Vaquero.

I have Vaqueros in both 357 and 45 Colt and I enjoy shooting the 45 Colt the most. However, I reload and you do not. The price, variety and availability of 357 ammo is much better than 45 Colt. Plus, you can shoot cheap target 38 spl ammo from a 357. There's no such alternative for the 45 Colt. Around here you can buy a 100 round box of 38spl FMJ or wadcutters for about $35. Any box of 45 Colt is gonna be about $40 for 50.

Six rounds of hot 357 self defense ammo is adequate protection from a 200-250lb bear. Maybe not ideal, but more than adequate. Besides, every black bear I've ever seen in the lower 48 outside of a national park will go running as soon as they become aware of you, especially when you're trying to hunt the darn things. I know mama bear will protect her cubs, etc, etc but in general there's not a whole lot of aggressive bears running around the central part of the U.S.

Buy a gun for it's intended purpose, not for how it might, some day, given the right circumstances be used. If you buy too much gun for plinking and horsing around on the off chance you might run into an aggressive bear someday you won't enjoy using the gun for the other 99.9% of the time. Get the 357.

What he said.

 

[WASP]

A bit confused here. Is this website inaccurate in saying ALL your bears are blacks? Arkansas Bears - Bears in Arkansas - Arkansas Wildlife

"Though relatively elusive, the American black bear - the only species of bear in Arkansas - ....."​

This is black bear American black bear - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is brown bear Brown bear - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

To make the terminology confusing there are brown colored black bears (and other shades as well) but they are all still black bears, maybe that is what you meant by black/brown bear? Just trying to get to the bottom of what critter we're talking about here because the two are very different in both size and behavior.

Yes the black and also brown colored bear, sorry. Like I said, I have never even seen a bear with my own eyes just pictures and video.
My sister was deer hunting in December, when she crawled down from her deer stand armed only with a cross bow there was a black bear standing 30 yds from her. She moved across to the truck 150 yds away and the bear followed her all but the last 50 yds, she was terrified. I plan to hunt hog with them and I just want to be ready just in case, not to mention the other woods I walk in up north from me far more often which is considered real "bear country" with a far bigger bear per sq mile/acre than anywhere else in the state.

We also have hog and quite a few feral dog packs. We also have Mt Lion which the game and fish still denies for the most part just like they do in many states but I know people who have seen them and there have been game camera shots, although if one of those gets you you will likely not see it coming. We also have heard reports in the far north west corner of the state. To many wolf reports to ignore but not enough to be worried about game and fish denies these as well.

 

[WASP]

He's buying the gun for fun and as a last resort maybe protection from a soft and cuddly Arkansas black bear. Under that criteria any handgun will do the job, even a 22. Not well, but it's better than throwing rocks. If you want to hunt bear there are better choices but for your stated purposes I'd get a 357 Vaquero.

I have Vaqueros in both 357 and 45 Colt and I enjoy shooting the 45 Colt the most. However, I reload and you do not. The price, variety and availability of 357 ammo is much better than 45 Colt. Plus, you can shoot cheap target 38 spl ammo from a 357. There's no such alternative for the 45 Colt. Around here you can buy a 100 round box of 38spl FMJ or wadcutters for about $35. Any box of 45 Colt is gonna be about $40 for 50.

Six rounds of hot 357 self defense ammo is adequate protection from a 200-250lb bear. Maybe not ideal, but more than adequate. Besides, every black bear I've ever seen in the lower 48 outside of a national park will go running as soon as they become aware of you, especially when you're trying to hunt the darn things. I know mama bear will protect her cubs, etc, etc but in general there's not a whole lot of aggressive bears running around the central part of the U.S.

Buy a gun for it's intended purpose, not for how it might, some day, given the right circumstances be used. If you buy too much gun for plinking and horsing around on the off chance you might run into an aggressive bear someday you won't enjoy using the gun for the other 99.9% of the time. Get the 357.

You are right about the buy something you enjoy shooting 99% of the time part, I mainly want it just for shooting. I also wanted it for the just in case scenario since it is likely I will eventually cross one reguardless of how unlikely it is to be aggressive. Like I said before, this will be my most powerful handgun in my collection so far, so I wanted to know it would get the job done. I love to shoot my Birdshead on .45 auto but I know that's not ideal for a backup woods gun unless that's all you have, then again my 1911 would have probably done that role as well as a SA.
If I lived up north I would probably get an everything gun, but I think this will do great for what I want it to do.

 

[Amigo Will]

Not perfect but worked.
Grizzly Bear Shot and Killed By Hikers In Denali National Park and Preserve | National Parks Traveler - Page 4

 

[fungun]

Given the info and choices it sounds like the 357 would be the way to go, but I'd prefer a 44 or 454.

 

[rclark]

Yes that has been my finding too that the vaquero won't hold up to heavy rounds, but my understanding was that the New Vaquero also can't handle .357 either, maybe that was just the Birds Head models idk.

I just want to make clear that the New Vaquero .357 will handle ANY and ALL .357 SAAMI loads you put in it. Remember this was over built even back in '55 when the medium frame was introduced, and the New Vaquero is on the same frame. Look at the mass of steel around those 6 holes... Then compare to the .44Mag which runs at the same pressure ... See what I mean? And materials are probably better today than even then.... No that's a o' wives tale about the New Vaquero can't handle .357 loads.... The ONLY thing you MIGHT run into is loads with lots of mass in front of the case which may extend a bit beyond the cylinder and ty it up. Other than that you will have no worries about what you put in your .357 ( birds head or not... frame/cylinder is the same).

I'll pack my .45s. But that's just me.

 

[WASP]

Thank you everyone! I think I have decided on a Single Six.... Just Kidding.

 

[Amishman44]

I'd say .45 Colt...I wouldn't use a 'standard' load .45 Colt against a bear...I would make sure your revolver can handle something like these:

.45 Colt +P, 300-Grain Cast Performance Long Flat Nose Gas Checked, Box of 20, Nickel-Plated Brass

 

[laidlerj]

Btw jim, my post in jest wasn't aimed at you, fishing guides from Oregon are just an easy target

SE AK has probably more bears than southcentral. Prince of Wales island is known for blacks, and Admiralty island has more browns per square mile than anywhere on earth.

No worries! Even though I'm living in Oregon, I'm not a fishing guide. And I concur that a lot of the "outdoorsmen" who come up from the lower 48 had over-inflated opinions of their expertise.

I think the point that a lot of people have been making in this thread is that defending yourself from an angry bear isn't easy. There is no handgun on the planet that will reliably give you a "one-shot stop" on a charging bear; about the smallest caliber that will do that is a 25X137 mm (M242 Bushmaster), and that's not a "handgun" in any sense of the word. However, I'm not saying that you should just give up and carry "bear spray" (which has been repeatedly shown to be ineffective against angry bears).

Momentum is what carries a bullet into the "kill zone" and that is a factor of bullet weight and the square of the velocity. But momentum alone doesn't kill an angry bear - you have to hit something so vital that you shut it down. It can take several minutes for a bear to become unconscious from even massive bleeding, and that's time enough for the bear to do the same to you. Even a shot that tears open the heart gives the bear several seconds to tear you to shreds before it dies.


Jim

 

[Varminterror]

Theory is great, but field proven evidence is better. I've knocked down enough large animals - including bears, most of those species with handguns, to know what "will work in a pinch" and what I want to carry if my life is on the line.

Energy is irrelevant. Penetration isn't everything either. Momentum dictates how much energy gets transferred to the recipient, and "stopping power" is about a lot more than just energy and velocity.

The 45 colt has 25% greater momentum than the 357mag.

Done deal for me. Even if either is "enough for bear," the 45 Colt is "more enough"...

 

[WASP]

From what most of you said it's a crap shoot anyway, I would imagine that that includes much larger calibers as well. I'm not saying it's all about luck either, but you would basically need something to scramble his brain and get far enough to do just that. Basically I wanted best of the two for multiple situations, the bear thing is for a "just in case" situation, not for specifically going bear hunting, although they are around where I usually go.
I will end up owning both eventually. In fact I might buy a .45 Colt New Vaquero Birdshead too....eventually. All I know is, this definitely won't be my last, I doubt I will limit myself to just one caliber either, but right now finances say pick just one.

 

[gqucool]

Then buy a .357, good caliber to start out with & build up from there!

 

[acbakken]

Done deal for me. Even if either is "enough for bear," the 45 Colt is "more enough"...

I think this statement sums up the situation. If you really need a gun to defend yourself carry the biggest and most powerful round you can control.

 

[chica]

I would say neither. 44 magnum would be much better for bear. If you want a 44 mag that is not too bulky look into Taurus. They make the ultra lite and also their 44 mag Tracker is easy to carry.

 

[Gunslinger 1]

I'd want the biggest bullet I could get against a bear!

 

[Hpr1993]

Sorry but I disagree with the “train vs motorcycle” comment. I know from personal experience what a motorcycle will do to a sheepdog when it hits it going 120....it made more of a mess of the dog than a train going 5 would have. Same concept on bear....except if the 45 at 1,000 FPS is a train in this case,the motorcycle would have to be a .22 moving at 50,000 FPS for that comparison to be reasonable. When penetration is a main concern, obviously size and mass will effect overall force but it’s truly the speed that wins the day. A 223 will pierce ar500 armor plating much better than say, a 12 gauge slug. The 12 will have MUCH more energy for breaking bones, but it’ll stop once it hits the object, as the potential energy is dispersed over a greater surface area, whereas a smaller bullet moving faster won’t crack the object, be it steel, bone, or what have you, but will punch a tidy little hole through it and actually hit the vitals behind it. Much the same as hitting a golf ball with an iron vs kicking the same golf ball with your foot. Your kick will have huge amounts of energy, but a golf club will apply ALL of its energy to the ball, where your kick will lose much of that energy and transfer very little to the ball. When comparing 45 long colt to 357 magnum, you don’t need to focus on which had a bigger number in front. Focus on the words behind. “Colt” or “Magnum”. I know which one makes me feel more confident.

 

[patkelly4370]

Given the choice between .357mag and .45lc, I'd choose 12g slug.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

 

[right2arms]

I'll throw in a wrinkle to this discussion. Get the .357 if that is your heart's content, but maybe get a .460 Rowland conversion for your 1911 .45 if it is one of them that can handle it. Would be much better at stopping a charging bear.

 

[Amishman44]

Well a 357 against bear is better then throwing rocks IMHO! The 357 is a great round but way under size for bear. 45 is more suited for the task. I have been in a few confrontations with bear and all have split quickly when a warning shot was fired in the air. But that time they dont run and charge you things happen fast and you need heavy bullets to shut them down!

I wouldn't carry a .357 magnum against anything that's not under 300#...when you start breaking the 300# barrier, I'd go heavier, like .44 magnum or .454 Casull (which the Ruger Alaskan will shoot the .45 Colt round as well.)

If you choose to go with .45 Colt...just keep in mind that Littlestone's builds a nice .45 Colt +P round that serves as an intermittent round between standard .45 Colt and the .454 Casull...and it's a nice fit in the performance gap between the two. If I remember correctly, Buffalo Bore offers a .45 Colt +P round as well.

I wouldn't recommend shooting the .45 Colt +P through a Vaquaro though...just sayin'.

Littlestone's Ammo: .45 COLT +P