Sorry, I use H110 and Wheelguns 325 gr ? powder coated lead bullet in my Freedom Arms. I have never tried AA9 in my Freedom Arms.

 

I don't load for 454 and I would have to consult my manuals for guidance. If what you say is accurate I can't find fault in anything that you've done so far and plan to do.

By the way, greetings and salutations and welcome to the forum.

 

It seems to me that your MBC bullet seats deeper into the case than the Lyman bullet in the manual. This will increase the pressure. Your starting load with your bullet could possibly bring you to an overpressure situation. Any time you change a component, you will potentially change the safe data. A chronograph is a good tool for testing your reloads. If your velocity is higher than recorded in the data, it is a good chance that your pressure is higher than the data.

If you aren’t looking for top velocity, and the fireball, recoil, and loud crack that comes with full power 454 loads, I would suggest a faster burning powder. I don’t have alot of experience with A#9. Some magnum powders don’t download very well. I am not sure if A#9 fits in this category. 2400 would be my choice, or possibly HS6, for lighter loads.

I hope this makes sense to you. For some reason it feels like I am all over the place today.

 

I've used 2400 with my own cast bullets with good success but I am loading an over 300 gr bullet. Since 2400 has become unobtanium, I agree with the post before, maybe you should try H110 but it likes full house loads. You shouldn't load it light. I have just recently tried HS6 and it meters well on 38/357 mag but not on the big iron.

 

I have had very good results with HS6 in 480 Ruger.

 

I've used 2400 exclusively for years in my 44 mag loads and shot thousands of rounds. During the first shortage when 2400 could not be found my powder guy recommended #9. The loads were similar and I couldn't tell the difference. I transitioned and never looked back. #9 is an excellent powder. I think you will get better results loading #9 down than with H110.

 

I’ve experimented some with No. 9 in my 10mm. I too have noticed unburned powder in the gun after firing. I went back to Blue Dot, Longshot, and Power Pistol.

 

Thank you for all the valuable feedback, folks! I spent a snowy morning today preparing an 8-step ladder test starting at 23.3 grains to 25.3 grains of AA#9. If none of the loads work well, I'll move to a different recipe with a faster powder.

 

starting at 23.3 grains to 25.3 grains of AA#9.

Alliant published a 30 KPSI load for the .45 colt that falls in the range for your ladder. The extra case length of the .454, 1/10th", should make little or no significant difference. I've done the same exercise with .38 loads in .357 brass, and .44 Special loads in .44M brass without any problems, for decades.

 

Hi folks,

I had an interesting session at the range to day shooting 82 rounds of my 8-step ladder test starting at 23.3 grains to 25.3 grains of AA#9. I shot all rounds but 2 of them did not behave normally. The shots for these 2 rounds were much weaker and made a fizzle sound rather than a bang and the recoil as minimal and at first I thought these were squibs, but the bullets left the barrel.

I don't think the AA#9 powder is fully igniting. There was lots of unburned powder on almost every shot. The unburned powder would get lodged between the cylinder and the cases most of the time and it made it hard to extract the cases sometimes (see photo below of the unburned powder caked up on the case).

For the most part the rounds fired and most of them were actually pleasant to shoot and accurate shooting a 50 feet target, but I did notice that there was sometimes a difference of noise and recoil even when shooting some bullets of the same powder load.

This leads me to suspect that the problem is indeed the primer not igniting the AA#9 powder. Strange because the FA recipe calls for non-magnum small rifle primer (Small Rifle Rem #7 1/2).

Do you have any insights? Is this really a primer issue? I'm eager to try one of my test loads with small rifle magnum primer to see if there is a difference.

 

Which rounds did this happen on? Lighter or heavier rounds? It sounds like your rounds were downloaded too far. I have had a similar experience downloading H110. How was your crimp. A heavier crimp will help with ignition.

 

The first time it happened it was on the round at the bottom of my ladder, at 23.3 grains. The second time it happened, it was towards to top of the ladder, at 24.7 grains. I used the Lee factory crimp die with a somewhat heavy crimp (3/4 turn of the crimp die from top of the case). I did not have any bullet jump the crimp during today's session.

 

Yea a heavier crimp might help. It may be too light a load and not enough pressure for a good burn. My Lyman calls for a magnum primer but Speer and Hornady use a standard rifle primer. Do you have access to magnum rifle powders?

Like I said I use it for all my 44 mag loads but I load it to the top end of lead bullet data and use a heavy crimp with Winchester primers.

 

Thanks Wheelsix and fixitagain for pointing out the crimp. Maybe the brass of those 2 rounds were and did not get a good crimp from the Lee factory crimp die?

I will look to purchase a box of small rifle magnum primers and will make sure to use a stronger crimp next.

I'll test both the topmost of the loads I tried today (25.3 grains) and the 25.7 grains listed on the Lyman manual.

Regards,
SPEED-SIX

 

We've all have been there before trying to refine the load. A little of this and a little of that, trying something else but when you get it dialed in Eureka. That's why most of my loads are boring, I use the same components and powder charge once I find something I like I stick with it.

I commend you on going about it in a thoughtful methodical manner. I started out doing that but over the years I've developed bad habits looking for shortcuts.

 

Good on you for listening to the report of each round. That is an essential skill for a reloader. If it doesn’t sound correct, always check the barrel before firing another shot. When I first started reloading, I put too much faith in a cheap powder measuring system. That caused the only squib I ever loaded. I took the rest home and pulled the bullets. The powder weights were all over the place. I haven’t used that auto drum since.

 

In looking at some original 454c loads data from a long time ago(not recommending, just as reference), the aa9 top loads were near equiv. to much of the older factory loads but at higher pressure than the h110 factory equiv. loads. Now days, I stay away from ultra high pressure loads regardless but will still load at high pressure.

I like h110 or really mostly w296 for near top tier loads unless really cold weather. Reliable & consistent

Hs6 is a great big bore powder for scaled down loads, with heavy bullets at least in my use. EDIT: (Great groups here but my only use so far has been bullets at 300gr and above ... lead, gc & copper.)

I am not expert enough to say something is wrong with aa#9, it just was not a favorite in my casulls. EDIT: (I think most slow powders typically perform better near high-end published loadings. Again that is, unless cold weather).

Great job on approach in developing loads! Some good points plus reminders.

 

Continued thanks for the insights and feedback, folks! I stopped by the LGS after work today and bought a few boxes of CCI small rifle magnum primers (#450). I'm looking forward to try these on my next load test.

If I can't get that to work I already have a pound of H110 powder that I can test as well. Will post my results here after next weekend. I made a note on the HS6 powder, if I can find it locally down the line.

I'll be a happy camper if I can arrive a reliable and fun-to-shoot 454 Casull load with more power than th 44 Magnum and at $0.45 per round, which is my current cost per round reusing brass.

Cheers,
SPEED-SIX

 

Hi folks, so this past weekend I loaded 30 test rounds of 454 Casull using 25 grains of AA#9 (each load was measured an powder tricker used to ensure consistency), my 255 MBC hi-and CCI Small Rifle Magnum Primer (#450), and I used a heavy crimp this time (see photo below).

The first 26 rounds fired well, with much less unburned powder than before, when I was using non-Magnum rifle primers. However, I did get a squib in the 27th round. The bullet got lodged in the barrel and I had to stop to clear it. The primer fired but the powder appears to not have ignited as most of it remained in the barrel, behind the bullet. The typical puff sound alerted me of the squib.

It was a chilly 21 degrees Fahrenheit at my club's outdoor range, so very cold! I did read that AA#9 does not behave well in cold weather. So I am officially ditching this powder for 454 Casull loadings and will move to try H110 and Titegroup next.

Here are some photos of my heavy crimped bullets from this last test

 

Just realize that H110 doesn’t like to be downloaded, and, although plenty of people use tightgroup for these things, to me it is a fast powder more suitable for light target loads. What is your target velocity? Trail boss, if you can find it, is another option for light practice loads. Your crimps look good to me.

 

Yes, I was avoiding having to use H110 since I know one should never go outside the published loads for that powder. That is not ideal to me cause I don't want to go nuclear all the time with this revolver. My target velocity is between 1,100 fps and 1,500 fps. I feel closer to 1,500 fps would be more fun to shoot in this revolver... magnum enough without making my hand sore after 50 rounds.

I'm planning on going to 10 grains of Titegroup for light loads. I wish I could find Trail boss around my area. So far, no luck.

 

I just checked out Hodgons load data site. I saw the titegroup data. I do know plenty of knowledgeable reloaders that use titegroup in situations like yours. It just goes against the way I was taught. Be very careful of a double charge. A double charge with a fast burning powder will blow your gun up. Because it is a fast powder, you will get a pressure spike when first ignited. Just be very careful.

In this day and age, a reloader needs to be versatile. Many times the powder chosen will be the one you have or can get. Keep your eyes and ears open for availability. You have a fast powder, titegroup, and a slow powder, aa#9. It seems you need a medium powder. Be on the lookout for one, and take your time. You are doing great! You would be surprised what you can figure out after some introspection.

 

Speed-Six, I've had a FA .454 for 25+ years and and have reloaded for it using AA-9 powder. I've only used 300 grain jacketed bullets. Your loads appear conservative to me; not necessarily a bad thing IMHO. I have used 25 grains of AA-9 with the 300 grain jacketed bullets and CCI #400 primers. This produced an average of 1359 FPS in my 4 3/4" revolver. Going to 25.5 grains produced an average of 1470 FPS, with CCI #550 primers. There were no excess pressure signs or other issues with either load. Similar loads with your lighter cast bullets would likely produce higher velocities than mine. I was not trying to achieve factory velocities either; 300 @ 1470 FPS reloads seemed like plenty to me...

Factory Hornady 300 grain averaged 1585 FPS in my revolver. Too Much!

 

I edited my previous post with a little more detail and also for whatever its worth below too... as i did check my notes for 255gr Keith SWCs use, had more excellent groups (in my FA gun) with an 'older lot' of IMR4227 from a 4.75 inch bbl. These results may be different than what is found with recent 4227 powders available today, IDK. Keep in mind though, most of my handloading until recent years has been for using heavy bullets (300gr plus) while fishing in bigger bear and wild bison country.

Did not chrono the 253-255gr (rnfp & swc) published load data that I actually did test (bullets weighing below 300grains) years ago, yet I remember and noted that recoil was much more pleasant with a substantial dose of slow IMR 4227 than with a heavy dose of slow aa#9, 255gr loads. Perhaps my improved felt recoil contributed to the better accuracy too. Think velocity could possibly have been in the 1380fps to 1420fps range using older IMR4227, based on published tests in a universal reciever.

I intitially got the idea to try 4227 from what John Taffin wrote about his use of it in the Ruger Blackhawk 45 Colt, then researched it from there for use in the 454casull.

PS: It would be interesting to see what modern powders can do compared to older powders such as published AA#9, H110, 4227, HS6, W231, UNIQUE and so on for the 454 Casull.

 

I purchased a couple Freedom Arms #83 7.5" barrel revolvers in the 90's. For years, I had been using a Dillon 550B to reload my handgun loads. I tried it with the 454. I found that W296 worked very well, so I didn't try anything else. Being a ball-powder, it metered very uniformly on my Dillon. For safety's sake, I weigh all my loads. I knew a guy who used W231 and had a double charge. The revolver survived, but his wrist was injured and the gun was dropped. I think W231 is too fast for this application. It is fun to shoot this revolver, as long as I don't have to shoot over 25 full loads.

 

Nice plus good info.